Watch: Ex-Googler Returns to India After 13 Years: Why She Left Silicon Valley for a Creative Life

3:16 Villages a bit later I wrote I'm writing my third book now I have worked with the large companies as well as startups and I'll tell you a little bit more about those details of how I decided to switch careers from technical into something that is more U let's say Arts driven that's

3:42 Great yeah thanks a lot for that high level overview so just so that I'm following this was the move primarily driven because of the opportunity with Google to explore some of the you know opportunities here in India or is that was an intentional was there any motivation Factor behind the move back to India if you can you know explain it that no absolutely not and you know ainash I've been working with nris for more than seven years and one of my USPS is that I'm brutally honest and the thing is that though a lot of n say I'm coming here for you know a better job or better opportunity the truth is there are a lot of cases most cases I would say 99% cases where things are not working out in the United States or where ever they're living and that's why they move back and there's nothing wrong with something being wrong I did not absolutely move back because there are opportunities here or any such thing America was incredibly lonely and it really got to me loneliness is an

4:45 Epidemic amongst not just Americans but the Indian Community that nobody's talking about and it is sort of swept under the rug the magnitude and intensity of it is not understood by others this happens especially to singles but also to married couples like I've had a lot of clients whove who spoken about how lonely they feel although they are married it's like oh it's just the four of us like me the husband and two kids and there's nobody else so this loneliness is a factor that really pushed me over the edge and I thought you know I'm living the same life again and again and again and again and again over the same year and something's got to change so I was sort of I would say pushed into a corner by myself to make a decision and the only option I I felt remaining was was to move got it so it

5:43 Was an intentional decision and then I think from a career transition wise you have this opportunity to move as an internal transfer within Google is that right the latter part is correct though I won't put it as an intentional decision you know it still feels like it still feels like a kitchy and that's why people are so confused because there is no one event or single thing that is pushing people to book that flight ticket yeah and because it's a mix of I I want to but I still don't want to but I have to and I can and I want like it's a mix of the wants and shoulds and can and so it's very very hard to say that it was intentional but it's hard to say it was not intentional either so yes it is a it's a a very nebulous sort of decision to make okay great so now

6:35 That I think you have been living here for S years especially like working in a technology company and moving into Arts I think we can kind of peel it towards that but how has the life being here social life work life just curious if there's anything that you can share on that like you know comparing between us and India in terms of the lifestyle and then the work side yeah oh I'll break that down into a few things because each of them there's like a lot of things we could talk about so the first is social life and you know from the viewers perspective there's this sense that you know social life will get better but we also have to put into consideration that you're aging and for people who are over 30 33 35 most of your people and friends around you are married with kids and once they have kids they don't have time to meet you and there's nothing wrong with with that it's just that how life changes so I I did seem to find friends through my

7:37 Work but they were let's just say great work temporary acquaintances so once I left the company that sort of withered off and I this is not a reflection of who they are as a person or who I am as a person it's just a matter of you know people are busy and cities are big and unless and unless even if like one of my friends stays literally above me here I hardly get to meet her so it's not like social life is booming but you your office is going to be your gateway to making a social life I couldn't make friends at Google actually it was funny because the Google Bangalore office people would just leave by 4:30 and the younger ones those were the married folks and the younger ones were they had their own group so they were nice to me but they won't make friends with me and I don't think I I I so don't see myself hanging

8:38 Around with 22 year although I don't mind it but yeah there it is it is hard you have to go to classes or places or to and actively make a a an effort to meet people workwise it has been very very hard for me I do understand that people are built out of different things people have different personalities and their adaptability is changes based on who they are as people for me I'm very sensitive and observational that's why I'm an author it really helps to for me to write but when it comes to actually being somebody who can take things at work like take bullets at work or whatever however you want to put it it it's been incredibly hard for me and it's not just bullets it's not like somebody's targeting me it's just the ability to accept that different people work in different ways talk in different

9:39 Ways that that has been hard and I'll tell you why where this is coming from California especially Google California Silicon Valley has become a bubble where they now teach you that everyone else had better behave the way you want them to behave so all these gender pronoun and all what is it it is like others have to respect what I want to hear and you you have to talk how I want to hear it India is the flip people will say any they want to you they'll say whatever they want you have to manage your own brain and I think this is this is a much better long-term philosophy because you you start looking inside yourself and you you're like okay why am I being so sensitive why is my happiness in somebody else's hand and it really helped me grow as a person so although working was was difficult it it changed me for the better I I have found my sort of as I say happy

10:41 Place I have found workarounds you know typical things where I've changed you know I've CH like since I'm senior by age maybe not by title some somewhat by title people are generally nice to me but I think it gets really rough when you're in your in your 20s so work and social life are are these two things I there's a host of a lot of other things I can talk about but I'll let you prioritize what you think your viewers want to hear oh yeah definitely

11:10 I mean again I think you know for someone who is thinking about you know moving back right I mean especially for somebody who lived for 13 years and who have been living in India for 7 years there might be certain thoughts or expectations or misconceptions that people might have I mean if there are any key areas that you wanted to touch Bas I think you know the typical things are the work Lifestyle the social lifestyle you know for the family whatever the other reasons could be right if there are any key points from your perspective maybe those are typical misconceptions that you might have seen people think about India when they're coning to move back I think that definitely would be very helpful yes while living abroad your lens of India is through Twitter and through news channels and through NDT TV and through New York Times which loves to hate India so there's a sense of so Twitter is a very angry place right so there's a sense of oh my God India is shocking

12:11 There's like discrimination and and you know people are like this and that and NIS come with a sense of righteousness that hey I know the right way of doing things and I'm so kind and I will teach you how to do things and like this is where you come and and it's and people are nice here right like I've seen lot of eniz behave like they're Superior and hey you know what at some in some senses I was like that to and it's not like I was actively behaving Superior it's just a thing that hey I I know so much I know so many wonderful ways of doing things in a much faster way let me teach you and it's like you know all this what you're coming as an NRI with may not necessarily fit into what is needed in India I'll give you an example so many U is every single time I write about my maid on online I have a lot of followers on lington someone corrects me and saying it's not made it's house

13:14 He okay and I can understand because I was that person when I was sitting in California California is incredibly left cleaning right so it's like no no no you better call her house help but here's the thing after being in India and like sort of the I'll use the word dealing with with how Ms or house helps or whatever you want to call them they own you and it's not like they are bearis and it's not like you're you know exploiting them you are giving them a means of employment that is respectful you're allowing them into your home you're being nice to them you're you're laughing and joking they're a part of your family and they don't care if you call them maid or hous help they care about the money they care about the respect so as an NRI when you when you're coming to India you're like oh I'm going to do things American way I'm going to pay my maid more I'm going to pay per hour more I'm going to give extra money in the long term you'll find that that doesn't really work you have to sort of adjust to become so

14:15 Quote unquote Indian and even if that sounds horrifying right now you will surprise yourself so what this means is that when when an NRI moves into India they have to be really open to the Indian ways of doing things and study and understand it instead of coming with a sort of righteousness and that anger that no I know the right way to do it and it is hous help and not made yeah so so so that's one thing and the second part is you know the the recreation of the US or or foreign life in India everyone wants it I wanted it but you basically your it's I I would say it's an iterative process and it's also a you know there's this sine wave or curve that dampens you know we used to do that in in physics so that that's going to dampen over time and you're slowly going to start integrating what is really working

15:16 For you to to live in India and it's not it's not scary like people come with this so much fear there's so much like anxiety that what what if if it doesn't work out no no no what is it's not like it doesn't work out you have to make it work out yeah for sure so yeah I think these are the two things that that nris need to watch out for no I mean those are two big things

15:43 Right I think you know you can't change the culture I mean I think you if you made a decision to be part of it I think you need to adapt or you know embrace it I mean I think the end of the day and live with it so maybe Switching gears a little bit I know there are you know few important topics that I would love to you know get your insights the first one I think you said kind of moving from a technology to an art so that's a big transition so what made you to transition into that like you know writing books or you know working with the NOS anything that you can share on that that would be helpful just yeah so this is very helpful for people who are who are yearning for doing something else and they're confused about what they're getting out of life while doing their jobs and this I think is a very large population of Indians feel this way because almost all of us are boxed into engineering or I'm I'm guessing most of the viewers are engineering it's like you either become engineer or doctor or

16:44 Nothing else now I would say that there is some higher power involved because there was a there was a time when I was in California I suddenly stopped being interested in Tech I was like I I was a spread spr sheet girl and I was like you know what this is a solve problem give me something else and I sely found that I was starting to get explore my creative side so I started doing food photography this many years ago it's 13 14 years ago from today I started doing food photography that led to me writing blog posts and those blog post started becoming funny my friends would read them and they would laugh and they would ask for more so slowly slowly I kept writing then it became a thing for me to keep writing and I literally had people one guy in Google he wandered about finding my desk in office and found me and came to me and said Nur you need to write a

17:45 Book I'm like wow okay so I continue I was I was by then I was a technical program manager in network operations and when I moved to India I saw the floodgates open that I can try anything oh my God I have no visa restrictions you know I have so much help here so I decided to do product of food photography after doing three or four paid clients actually one paid client and two two clients that I was trying to convince I realized India is a very cost sensitive market and the the amount of effort I put into food photography and the perfectionism is not appreciated it's like ah whatever so I very quickly figured that from all the 100 things that I wanted to do I started to eliminate things and this in in this India really helped me why because I was able to leave my job sit at home and explore and when you are

18:47 Just exploring a certain thing then you start thinking in a very different way you start thinking about the business angle the money angle so I eliminated food photography so many other things and then I got an opportunity to write my first book then I I still was still doing things on the ground I I worked for a small startup then I wrote my second book then I co hit I was I decided like let's get a full-time job and I worked for that company for two and a half years and then I was like oh let's retire so that I can write books full- time and by this time I'm I'm this is my third my starting my third book right by this time I'm like yeah I want to be an author I've explored enough I know I want to switch careers and I'm ready for it let's do it let's sit at home and write a book and you know what avash I I quit my job on Friday it was I think

19:48 5th August Monday 8th August the plan was go to co-working spaces in Bangalore and make friends there and write my book 8 evening I was balling I was crying so much so much and next day also I was crying third day I like this is not panning out the way I thought I thought I'll go to co-working spaces and make friends and I slowly there this idea of retiring and just sitting at home and doing what I love is is feels so different from what it sounds like on paper and and what do means for the audiences when you're thinking of retiring and you're like oh I'm going to do Pottery M making I would s just do try it out but be open to coming back to the workforce so since then I've decided that it's best for me as a as a person and I'm not saying this is a cookie cutter for everybody a formula for everyone as a person I'm an extrovert I need people around me and so for me having a full-time job is much much keeps me happy let's put it that

20:49 Way so this this has been a transition it was not without it was not linear right like I'm saying it in a way that is it's smooth but the the it was never a confusion of if I should do this or not it was never there and for readers who are like you know I know I want to do whatever Potter making or photography that that that it comes from your gut and it's it's so solid you know you want to do it the the only thing is the the I really needed some mentorship on figuring out how to manage my thinking around this thinking around money thinking around handling people finding the job that really makes me feel comfortable so that I can pursue all of this so there's a lot of not planning but a lot of ups and downs and lot of k k k that goes on before you actually settle into something that works for you yeah great I think you

21:51 Kind of touched about this I think you know how quickly it changed but curious I mean again if you are comfortable only like you know please share so when you made the decision about retiring early like you know following your heart and you know not working for money just working what you really believe in like was there any from from a financial perspective anything that you can share like is there something that you looked into yes this makes sense and so ready for you know leaving a full-time job and just going with you know retiring early like is there anything on from that perspective that if you're comfortable you know would allow to get some insights there because that's something that always a question from I know some of the listeners and you know the perspective that they would always be interested in so th% of my men male clients ask this question and 0% of my female clients I have had zero female clients come and say Hey I want to check my Investment Portfolio how much money do I need to retire zero z00 0 and I

22:53 Helped more than thousand thousand like thousand people in person and off on on email like even more than that so it's it sounds like a very guy thing and it's not wrong I'm just saying it's it's very different and especially a married man with kids is something who will be interested in what what should my portfolio looks look like I didn't look at it because these decisions are so overwhelming and you can't stand being in that that position anymore that it's like you know even if you have nothing in your bank I'm still taking the plunge yeah it just figure it out and and you know this is what I wanted I'm so glad you brought that up because I I want to give a very different answer to this especially to Indians who are saving and saving and saving to do what what like sit on your rocking chair when you're old and then look at your bank spend it now like nris are so incredibly conduced it's not even funny and I'm I'm seeing

23:53 The day in and day out I'm seeing the decisions that nris are making based on you know like a $5 coffee to saving for living in some apartment like why just spend the money on yourself and live your life because you are going to die with money in your bank so so I would say like do yeah do look at your Investment Portfolio but that's the beauty of India is that you can survive without money yeah that

24:23 Reminds me a book I think it's called zero die with zero so I think the idea behind it is not to leave the money in the bank right even if it's inheritance I mean you already made a decision to decide on it but it's enjoy the life I think instead of like you know sitting on the money but anyway just absolutely and see you know the perception of your friends around you I'll give you an example I have a friend who's incredibly Rich he is doing really really well like I'm not even going like you know maybe say say Amazon May he's a big shot or something like that and I was talking to another person in India actually a client of mine and he was like I know this guy I was like oh there a friend of mine and you know what is the only thing he said about him not that he had achieved so much he said literally whoever's listening to this if you are being stingy with money even once that's all people are going to remember so I I would say please live your American or whereever foreign life

25:25 With a little bit of flow from your wallet okay let your wallet money flow spend on yourself spend on clothes spend on grooming I'm actually going to bring this I've already brought this condus topic up in my book back home and I'm writing my third book right that's for single n right so I have a little bit of that in in it as well great so

25:46 Yeah thanks I mean so let's talk a little bit about your books like you know what's the you know the three books that you mentioned like you know what's the main theme if you can share a little bit of information I think that would be helpful yeah sure my first book was exploratory for me I made it fictional because I didn't have the guts to write it in person it was right it was about my experience in in the semi-government not government government was actually great to work with surprisingly because there's a lot of clean hayaki it's like you have to listen to this person and the you work with is folks right they're very very very very smarts you're working with incredibly intelligent people but in the semi government I had some interesting experiences which have fictionalized and put in my first book it's not my intention to to Market that book it's just something I did for myself yeah the second book back home is for nris who are confused about the about moving to India it's again it's

26:47 Non-fiction I I write non-fiction Better Than Fiction it's a guide and it's a fast read so people have U it's got great review on Amazon people love it it's funny it's fast it's interesting so I would highly recommend people to read it even if you're not looking to move not even confused it'll help you understand you know those little nuances in India that I had to adjust to for example I've spoken about how people don't keep the door open here in India and how like many times it's slammed in my face and I've got so angry I mean not at them but in my head I'm like yeah what is this why did I come back to India and all of that but yeah you get used to it now this third book I'm going to call it alone abroad and it is for single narise and all the frustrations and the difficulties that they they are facing as single people and the the pressure of marriage the societal pressure of of getting married and dating for especially for nris is

27:50 Very nuanced I'm not saying that Indians in India don't face this but it is specifically hard of for for Indians abroad I've I've I'm spoke speaking about loneliness and and how to deal with friends and jealousy and you know the time pressure of getting married like in in Indian culture once you're 30 you you and you're not married you might as well go die somewhere you know like people are just like you're off you're off the planet you don't exist anymore so so these type of things I want to address because I really feel like these topics are not spoken about in the indan Community especially the NRI community and I even Explore like will will moving to India really help solve this problem because I have plenty of clients in their mid-30s living abroad who are like I am so fed up of dating here of being single here I think I want to move to India I'll be able to

28:50 Meet more women there or meet more men and so I want to discuss that topic a little bit no yeah thanks for sharing

28:58 The information so we will leave the links to these books so that people can check it out and you know definitely very relevant to the audience here with that said I know you have helped and you also currently help lot of nris who are concerned to move back maybe you can talk a little bit about that services like you know what you do or what you offer and how it works so that people have an understanding on that absolutely so when I started out I I I was always writing about my experiences and I found that it resonated very well with with Indians abroad and I felt like getting some I realized that getting some structure around this is very helpful so for me as of now I have I have my book that people can read and help them get a better sense of what this move is about I for Consulting sessions so somebody can book a oneon-one with me with themselves or for

30:00 The married folks with their spouse and in one session I kind of give high level pointers on on what to expect what not to expect and what kind of help them piece through their decisions and make make a better decision or eliminate certain types of decisions and also since I have worked with so many people I also have aggregated information about what works and what doesn't work based on that particular person's questions and the the situation that they are in so that that has been incredibly that is incredibly helpful for people and again my Approach is BR brutal honesty and you know aash I don't sell India to people so I do know there are other people who also help nris and they come from the lens of the reverse brain drain I'm not saying there's anything wrong with that but my my philosophy is that you do what is best for you in this phase of your life and so I help of a

31:04 A range of people have help students and people in their singles in their mid 20s I help them also around lifestyle design how to live a prop life while abroad many clients are you know the couple with two kids or the fighting couple the most interesting in in a sort of sad way where one couple wants to move to India and the other one doesn't so I've helped sort of quote unquote convince the other side or at least help one person see the other person's point of view and I've even seen people you know whose kids have gone to college and they are like you know what I want to you know say go back to Baroda and retire in my hometown so what do I do so I've seen a whole range of of people of different circumstances and and situations okay yeah great I mean I'm

31:57 Sure I think it now it's always good to have that sounding board and somebody who has seen these different scenarios and provide a feedback and guiding in terms of the journey so that they can make the right decision so is there any topic that we haven't covered that you would like to you know bring up and make sure that the audience are aware of it there are many things that we could talk about but I I really feel that you know just understanding that your life is going to change by a magnitude is is is important to know and to be ready that things are really going to change exponentially when you when you make this move one example that I I do give is Fitness because I was crazy about Fitness in the US and you know how California is like you can do so much everybody's into fitness like everyone's running a marathon or something like that and after being that you know girl who goes to the gym gym N9 days a week seriously

32:59 Nine days a week here I'm going zero days a week and I've tried so many ways different gyms and ways of staying fit and that really has not I've not been able to get back into those Fitness levels as abroad and it's something that I've learned to accept but it's really you know it's it's hard to to to digest that some things may just not be the same and and for me I found a work around that so for example Fitness related right like the gyms here especially for women your experience of India as a man versus a woman is going to be different as a woman what I found when I go to many gyms the the trainers come and give Gan India man are people love to give Gan so you have to navigate and I've been very nice but they they come and they start showing you son and I've done weight training for eight years right it's it's almost like I know even more than the trainer

34:00 But they look at you and they judge by your looks to see whether you know or not and it gets very annoying so one of my friend my local friend taught me that when you go to the gym you have to act like you know everything and you have to show off a lot you have to be like I have learned in us and I've done this and done that and that way they'll stay away from you I can't do that like I can't that's not me as a person but you see how how hard it's been to to sort of navigate and I've actually left gyms because the trainer wouldn't leave me alone they would just keep tooing in between it was just super annoying so for me U you know I've yet to find that that gym where I'm feeling comfortable and it's close enough it took me six years to find a good apartment housing in India is non-standard and it's it's not up to the mark there's so many things that you could just sit and complain about but I would certainly say say that mental health is the top most winner here

35:01 Just having people around the support like even you know right now as I'm speaking it's it's 8 9:00 a.m. in the morning my maid is here so first I get to see people like there's a Watchmen downstairs they talk to me I think that the people in India is just so warm and friendly and that just makes up for all of this like I understand I just said spoke about a trainer doing giving Gan but he's also coming from a place of friendliness so if you want to talk to someone this trainer will happily give you Gan it's just that I don't want it in that particular situation but yeah it's it's it's you come here for the people to in India and of course the the land is beautiful like you know at the end of the day whatever Falls India has it's still it's still our our home yeah you know no thanks for that I know I

35:58 Think the last one is is there any advice that you would suggest or give for people who are considering about I mean again as you said it's not for India or not but it's it's an important to for them to kind of make a decision in one way or the other when I a decision again it's not an easy decision there's a lot of convolution and all the stuff but from your perspective any advice or any suggestion for future aspirants that who are considering to move yeah the first thing is throw that spreadsheet out especially goes for guys who are like huddled over spreadsheet and be like how is this going to work throw that spreadsheet out because at the end of the this is going to be a gut decision it's going to be an emotional sort of decision ask yourself when I'm 90 years old and I look back what is the one thing I'm going to regret not doing and if that answer is not moving to India then then make that move but if that doesn't bubble up as your answer then maybe you have to think a little no and the second thing is please please

37:00 Please spend the money please ask you know ask $100,000 questions ask 50,000 fet view questions and not questions like questions that you can Google like can I get my cat to India or I I call these the Samsung TV questions where people are like oh can I ship my Samsung TV like who cares you know like buy a new on here it's just like it's just lack or so like ask yourself bigger questions lead a better life and spend money and just be rise above all of this I think the Indian Community has to uplift Itself by asking $100,000 questions and not you know $5 questions or $500 questions and and ask yourself what that means ask yourself what are the questions I'm looking at today that are $5 questions $500 questions I can't give an example you

38:01 You you know what like Samsung TV is a $500 question so I I feel like I I implore the Indian Community to uplift itself to look at things from a bigger picture being not be Penny wise and pound foolish and and and enjoy life like literally life is meant to be lived it's not meant to be you know yeah sure do your spread cheat but then don't live by it yeah yeah cool I think I know it's definitely a personality right I mean some people are very analytical but it also important to take the gut feel and something that you don't want to regret I think that's the key thing you just have to you know go with that and make sure you you make a decision whatever it is I think you know so that you don't regret in the Life later so thank you very much you know for all your time and you know insights from your journey and speaking to lot of nris who are ConEd to

39:01 Move and by the way audience I think you know Nur and I have been talking about you know probably like having a a webinar in the near future so where she can distill some of the information that she has you know summarized you know talking to so many different nris so that you know people are aware of the different things to consider before the move or the things that they can decide before the move so more info to come but just want to give a sneak peek or give a heads up on that with that thank you very much for your time and really appreciate you taking an opportunity and speaking to our audience here thank you so much aash great thank you all for joining us on this insightful Journey Of Da return if you enjoyed this episode and want to explore more stories and expert advice make sure to subscribe and hit the notification Bell don't forget to leave

40:03 A comment below with your thoughts and experiences by the way check out the links in the description below for our Facebook group and social media for updates and engaging discussions as well as connecting with fellow the wrers thank you once again and until next time may your the written journey be filled with joy growth and endless possibilities