Watch: The Truth I Realized After Living in the US for 8 Years | Back to India

3:23 What motivated you to give it a try to go to abroad? Yeah, for for me like it was more like okay, exploring the world. Like I just try out some some better opportunity some something outside abroad as well. Financially I was in a stable job here as well. So initially I not thought about that okay, I will earn better there, but was mostly just that okay, let's let's experience something different and there is opportunity to go to country like United States where it's it's a kind of opportunity. So yeah, let's let's give it a try. Yeah, that's that's how we just started on this. Got it. So how was the life in US and where were you living in US? Yeah, the the life was great. It definitely when you land there, you you see a lot of shiny things. It's a very different country than than here in India. So initially it was very exciting. Everything was coming as a new. The experience was very good.

4:21 I moved to Seattle there and that's where I've been mostly for about eight years I was there. Yeah, so some of my friends were also there. So and one of my close relative was also there. So they also helped me like settle down there. So initially that's how like some of the people feel that okay, moving to a new country, you might feel lonely or you might not have friends. For me it was not that bad especially because I had couple friends from college, couple friends from my same company as well as one of my relative as well. So that made my transition a bit smoother. Got it. So I know you mentioned like maybe let's try out abroad for a couple of years and it took like eight years. What got changed? How it evolved? Why the thought about moving to India, you know, occurred?

5:11 Yeah, so I think when we started or when when I decided that I will go to US, it was more like okay, it's more exploratory that okay, we'll just give it a try and things are well here in India as well. So had no plan to to work longer there. But when I moved there, things are pretty good there as well, right? The infra is good. The opportunities are good. Later when my wife also joined, we had a kid as well. So we we kind of felt settled there. So that's how things were like okay, things are doing well there as well. So we kind of continued in the flow. We're like yeah, we will move back. So we I was very clear from the day one itself that I will not be settling there. I will come back. I re-evaluated this later as well when I was there that whether I want to continue or should I go back. And me and my wife we kind of decided that okay, long term we don't want to be here. We will retire or we'll we'll spend our longer time in India only.

6:10 So that's how then we continued the flow there. Years kept on going on, but yeah, so that's how continued. In in the middle COVID also happened. Around the time we were we were planning as well to okay, we might come back. But that also stretched our stay a bit longer there. There were also some career kind of aspirations that I had into like promotions and whatnot. So that also delayed it a little. And once I felt that okay, I have achieved my milestones. I'm not looking for something immediate into career growth.

6:46 That that's when we decided that okay, now now probably I can come back. Got it. And just before jumping on on the the timing, right? Like were you on H1 or on a B1 visa when you went abroad? for me luckily I was able to try it out as well. So I had went on a B1 visa initially for about two weeks on a on a business trip that my employer sponsored. So that's where like I had seen the first hand. And but later when I moved over for a job, I went on L1 visa. Yeah, so went there on L1 and then my employer applied for H1 as well. And luckily again got picked for for H1 visa in the very first attempt.

7:31 I was like okay, I'm here only for couple years. I don't even I was even feeling hesitant to even apply for H1, but I was like okay, let's give it a try and got picked. And then that continued. I in the middle like I said, I was always sure I will move back. I don't want to retire, but in the going into the flow, I even applied for green card as well. So I'm in that lottery queue as well. I'm still there into the queue. Yeah, so then continued for H1 and about eight years I continued on on that only. Got it. And was your wife also working in abroad during that time? No, she she is a housewife. Yeah, so she she got her EAD. She did try a job for a short period, but yeah, we have a kid as well. So things were a little busy at home. So we decided that okay, let's let's first take care of the younger kids before going to job. Yeah. Makes sense.

8:24 I know you mentioned about certain milestones, right? I think I know once you felt like you hit milestones and you feel like there is nothing like concrete in the near term, that's when you made the decision concrete decision to move back to India. So anything that you can share about those milestones? I know why 2025 specifically? Like what are those milestones that you have in mind? And yeah, anything that you can share on that. Yeah, so on the milestone wise like on the career growth wise, I was hitting closer to to a promotions around around COVID time. So that's why I waited for for that to materialize because yeah, moving to a new country it could have it can reset things. I was closer. So I

9:06 Was like okay, I will I will complete this. Personally as well, we we we were planning a kid at the time. And my my first kid is India born. We had an opportunity to even take have them as well as US citizen, but at that time we were like young. So we didn't take that risk of taking my pregnant wife to US at the time. So the first one is a Indian citizen. But the second one was yeah, the second one is a US citizen. That's where like after learning about all the rules and regulations around visa and whatnot and learning from friends, we decided that okay, let's let's have a second kid. And so before we move back to to India. personal the career growth wise was looking up to promotion. Personal growth wise personal family wise, I was looking up for a kid. So kind of they they both aligned well together.

9:58 And yes, once I kind of went through these, that's when we are like, "Okay, now that I don't see any immediate next milestone whether in career or on the personal side, that's when we decided that, okay, I will I will come back." I also had a personal family situation as well and that was also the motivation that I wanted to come back to to kind of help my parents. they are aged and and need a bit of support on the medical things and what not. So, there were certain situations that they went through and at at the time like right after COVID and I was like I was not able to help them at the at the time there. So, that that was also the motivation that I was like, "Okay, I I now need to move back." that I was very sure and once I hit these milestones that I was looking forward to, after that I I I just decided to move back. Got it. Understood. So, I think you mentioned about like moving in 2025. Like when did the plan actually start like, you know, whether so so that it can do the required steps to make the move successful?

10:59 Well, not 2025. I moved in the mid 2024. so, the plan kind of well, I was like I I always knew that I will be moving back. So, things were always aligned like that only. For example, I never had a major investment so like home or or yeah, such things in in US. and financially as well whether my investments whether in equity or real estate, they were a bit planned such that any long-term investments were mostly in India while short-term ones were in in US which I can easily withdraw and and and move them here. So, that that's on the investments. and job-wise for me again, I got lucky that the the employer they they had a office here as well in India and they they are supportive with the internal transfers. So, yeah, I talked to some of the just my employers, some of the teams here and they were willing to hire me. So, that was the easy part for the move for me especially because I I didn't have to hunt

12:00 Around for the job. It was easy easily sorted and that even made my move as well as smoother because then I had one less variable to to worry about. it

12:10 Was only, "Okay, I need to settle down the family and set up the home and what not." while job was already sorted for me. Got it. Understood. So, it sounds like I think you made the setup such that, you know, the transition will always be smoother. Like since the beginning you always have that in the back of your mind. so, I think in terms of the decision process, I know you mentioned about the reasons, right? I think there is a family situation you always have the interest to move back. But I mean, living 8 years in US, experiencing the different things, right? Like you said the shiny objects, the work culture or like some of ease of doing things or you know, career progression. If if if if they if it matters, is there anything that you thought about like, "Okay, these are the things that you would have as a pros and cons in India?" Yeah, these are the things that you would have pros and cons in US. How did you go through the decision process and decided, "Yes, you know, India makes sense for your situation." Like is there anything that you'd be missing in US also like that kind of a thing is is there?

13:09 Right. yes, I definitely went through that. initially when when I moved to to US, I was like, "Okay, I will be there a couple years." But also had in mind, "Okay, I will be coming coming back." But I didn't just follow that. I did my pros and cons kind of analysis later to to see again if I really want to move back or should I should I stay in the US itself. So, I did that pros and cons analysis and some of the things like were kind of came as a non-negotiable for me that there is no way I can work around these. whether like house and what not or the environment and and finding it the more easier to live. all those things I think in US also things are very good and that's why I continued and lived there for longer period than initially had estimated. but things around the family right?

13:55 The supporting the parents and being closer to the friends and family. and that's where I feel even more happy when when I join them in into family functions and events. People who are getting married, I was missing those parts. So, the these were the things that I realized that, okay, no matter how much I try to come from US or try [clears throat] to if I try to settle in US, I will never get to participate in these things and I will not be I will be feeling like I'm missing out on these important things. While the other things whether it's it's job or lifestyle improvement, I'm like, "Okay, it my background experience and skills and education, I I can get a good job and can earn well in in India as well." So, that's where those things didn't matter that much. They didn't make that much of a difference than that, "Okay, I want to be closer to the family." And that's where I I kind of enjoy as well more.

14:50 The other things as well that I noticed was I was living as Indian in the United States, right? So, that means whether it's my the way of living or or the kind of food habits. For example, I'm a vegetarian, I don't drink. so, these things makes it little harder there, right? And my my wife is more on the religious side. So, she she wants to go to temples and kind of celebrate all the festivals. So, what what I realized is if you want to be in the US, you it's better you live like a American there. Then you will feel home there and you will be more happier. But we were not doing that. We were living as a Indian in in in in the states. so, that was making it little harder to to kind of adapt to the American culture and and make friends there. so, our friend circle was also

15:40 Very much limited to Indian friends or only. yeah, so that that's where then I was like, "Okay, when I looked at longer term that down the line if when if I I think at 20 years down the line or when I'm retiring, I couldn't find myself retiring in in in the United States. that when I thought about this that that thing thought itself was like, "Oh, no, I can't do that. I can't retire here. Things will become very lonely and I will miss so many good things or so many festivals and what not from India." so, those were the like in the pros and cons list that, "Okay, these are the things I definitely want to go back to to India." I also compared the other side negative things whether it's bad infrastructure or pollution and high population and all those things as well.

16:26 That's where I did I had done those pros and cons analysis. and that was the good part as well. If anybody else is moving, I will suggest them that do this analysis as well. the especially about India, you you have been you grew up here. You know all the bad things and good things about it. So, you will not be surprised if you do a bit of research there. and that's where you will not be like, "Okay, you come back here and then you think you have double thought, 'Oh, why did I come back or should I move back?'" Even you have all the data data points in front of you, you can do the pros and cons analysis and if you do your research well, you you will not be surprised once you move back. Got it. Cool. Now, thanks for sharing that. So, let's talk a little bit about I think on the career side. I know you had the opportunity to take an internal transfer. You worked in India before going to US and then you moved back and I think it's been about 1 and 1/2 years since you moved back. So, in terms of the work culture, in terms of the opportunities, especially someone who has you know, more than a decade of experience. Like how does the

17:27 Opportunities in India? I think that's a statement that you made and also like in general the work culture. Like you know, you have experienced before and after. Like was there a shift difference? Anything that you can share on that? yeah, definitely. And yes, there is there is a difference and even I I also noticed some things as a surprise. I was not prepared for those. when I worked initially my 2 years, I was more of a junior engineer. So, things were like mostly whatever is coming and I was not much exposed to the other things, right? So, and I kind of sense I enjoyed that that work. when I moved back, I was of the same mental mindset that, "Okay, things were well at the time and now when I'm moving as even as a senior things will be similarly good. the work will be good and what not." but no, that's that's that's not the case.

18:15 The when I moved here, the opportunity-wise yes, I I I was able to move internally itself. So, that that was good. however, the opportunities are a little different. The the kind of work that or impactful work I was able to do do in the United States, that was better, more impactful and as well as the work-life balance and those things were were better there. versus here, the it's the kind of the same team, same work. but still not that much exciting kind of projects here. so, I'd say the the India acts as a offshore kind of office for most of the companies, right? And that is pretty evident as well. A lot of innovations and impactful work happens in the states only. Here it is the the extended office and where we are mostly playing a supportive role. That's what my experience has been. Some of the companies, some of the team, they do good work as well. But percentage-wise if you will see, it's it's on the lower side versus you will find better work,

19:11 Better opportunities in the states. Yeah, that that So, this came as a surprise to me. I was under the impression I will be able to do the similar kind of work, similar impactful work. But now that that became challenging here. Got it. Understood. And then in terms of the place where you moved to, you moved to you know, a place where your family is or like, you know, because of the work you have to move certain place and you mentioned, you know, family medical help is one of the aspect. So, how did you choose about the place and how you are managing both like on a career side as well as a family side? yeah, on the place definitely I would have preferred to live closer to the family in my native and all. But the jobs are not there. so, I I moved to Bangalore. My family is from Madhya Pradesh. So we are still a bit far but still not that far as states, right?

19:57 You can always travel. Parents can come anytime. So I chose Bangalore. Before this when I moved to to states, I was in Hyderabad and I so that's where I was deciding whether I should go to Hyderabad or Bangalore. I decided Bangalore especially due to the weather is very good here. So Seattle on the west side is also the weather is good at least in summer. Winters are horrible there as well. But yeah, Bangalore is good throughout the year. I had a couple of my cousins as well here. So and a lot of friends here. So that way I was like, "Okay." And they are all married, have kids and whatnot. So with that I will have the kind of a group there that that I can join. Hence instead of going to Hyderabad, I came to Bangalore. The weather as well as my my extended family, the cousins and and friends that that made the decision.

20:45 Parents, yeah, they are still far but yeah, we travel a lot now. They could sometimes visit us or we visit them. Got it. And I'm assuming your kid might be in a primary school at the time of the move. Like so which curriculum did you select? How did you go about it? And yeah, the school and the curriculum. Yeah, yeah, my my elder one was in in first grade at the time when when we moved here. So they joined in the second grade here. We I chose CBSE. A lot of folks also tried the international curriculum so I see see it at all. I didn't go to that. I also have a bit of longer term for the plan to settle down in closer to my hometown and I plan to leave the corporate IT jobs in Bangalore in couple of years. So that's where I like, "Okay, if they are in CBSE, the CBSE schools are everywhere.

21:35 So for them the transition will be smoother." I know CBSE can be a bit more like challenging or difficult as well. Or and it's a little different curriculum than the what my kid kid used to in in the in the US. But they are young so I was like, "Okay, they should be able to adjust." And from my own experience, it's like if you are going through the hardship in the in the education, you can easily then adjust in the other curriculums. Right? CBSE comes as a bit of on the harder side. So yeah, I was like, "Okay, with that they they they this is the better choice for them." But yeah, I would say different people go with different curriculums. Yeah, so some a lot of my friends are I have put their kids in the international school as well. And especially when when they

22:21 They joined the CBSE, even I was a little hesitant or I was a bit I was scared as well that, "Okay, how will they adjust to the school?" Especially around the language subjects, right? They are used to only English in in the states and the especially in the study. On speaking, we we since I we I always knew I will be moving back and I'm from Hindi belt. So we were speaking Hindi at home and so they they knew speaking the Hindi speaking so that that was fine. But they never knew how to write or whatnot. They never did that. So that was still a challenge and in Bangalore, Kannada is also a third language there. So we were a bit afraid that whether they will be able to adjust. But surprisingly, the it was a bit very smoother for for the kids as well. The the way education system has evolved in India is also pretty good. It it has become a bit similar to to states itself now.

23:18 Like there are a lot of fun activities or like a lot of extra curricular activities as well whether they have dance classes or music and sports and arts. They go on a lot of field trips, fun Fridays. So I can relate or my kid can relate all those to the states schools as well. So hence like it was not that hectic for them that there are a lot of homework and whatnot. No, nothing like that. If we I was kind of relating it with my own education that, "Okay, things will be if they it's at that difficulty level that the kids will find it difficult." But no, they didn't because the the curriculum has changed a lot. So they very easily adjusted. Language did make made it little difficult. But yeah, in the first year kind of we focused on on Hindi and they they did well in in a year. In the second year we kind of then focused on Kannada. So now they are improving on that as well. So yeah, I think it went pretty well for for kids as well.

24:09 Got it. So overall, how was the life in India? It's been about 1 and 1/2 year and in terms of family, in terms of everyone settling and how how is how are things overall? overall like I would say I'm pretty happy with the with the move. There are these pros and cons whatever I had thought about, I didn't see much surprises there. Most of them are as applicable. Things are whether it's pollution or bad infrastructure. I was already aware of all that. So I was prepared for that. Some of the things that because I was aware, I was prepared as well for them. For example, staying closer to the office so that I don't have to struggle with the traffic every day. As well as yeah, like infra or or public parks and whatnot, that's it's not that well maintained here. In states, it's always easy to just use public parks and we we we every week used to go somewheres, weekends and whatnot.

25:06 But here I was I I knew that, "Okay, we will not be able to go much outside to

25:11 All the parks and these facilities." So instead of that I like I kind of chose to stay in apartments, large community that have all sorts of amenities. So that made a major difference. So that in kind of overall uplifting my lifestyle here as well. And that's the other thing as well that before before I moved to states, I I was living a certain lifestyle and when I moved back, I intentionally ensured that my lifestyle goes up. Because that's how I will be able to adjust here and will enjoy the life here as well. Otherwise, we'll keep on comparing with the states and we'll keep on regretting, "Oh, there were so many good things in states and we are not doing here things are not that good." But because yeah, like I improved the lifestyle, stayed closer to the office to to beat these other problems, stayed in a good apartment with all the amenities. So things became very smoother here. Like all the classes whether it's for swimming or dancing, you get easily in all your apartment complex itself. Whereas in states, I was dropping kid there to to some some classes and then picking them up. So

26:12 Those kind of things also improved here then. So that's where like there are some negative things about India and in flying and whatnot. But then there are so many positive things. Especially the things which for which I moved here like supporting the family, staying closer to them, attending the family functions, celebrating the the festivals. Those improved significantly and no regrets there. So I was like, "Okay, yes, I moved for this and I am getting all that." And the negative

26:41 Things, no surprises there. I was kind of prepared for them. So yeah, that also went well. Got it. So I know the inflation is a big thing in India, right? I mean I think it's across the world. But I mean I think you know, if if you're open like you know, is there like a cost of living range that you can provide someone you know with a family of four with two young kids and you know, people in Bangalore. I think it would help like other people who are thinking about it to just get an idea of the real data, right? That's why I'm asking if you're open to share that. Yeah, yeah, I'm fine with that. It's a it's a rough range. So yeah, about me for me like the the expenses are coming about to 2 lakh INR a month. That's what I'm looking at. It's it's more of a recurring thing than there are sometimes these these one-time expenses whether it's travel or yeah, like supporting the family. So those are outside.

27:34 But yeah, in Bangalore if somebody is moving, you can plan around 2 lakh per month is going to be the roughly the expense here. Got it. And then in terms of the immigration, I know you mentioned about I think you applied for the green card like you know to give you on the queue. So did you move like with your I-140 and like you know if if there's anything that you can share on that aspect like you know at the time of the move? >> Yeah. I I was never prepared for applying and whatnot, right? But however these just things keep coming off coming from the employer side and I kept on applying as well. So that's how I entered the H-1B

28:10 And then I entered I-140. Yeah, so I'm in the queue and seems like the queue is long. It's going to take multiple decades before I can be picked into that. So I'm continuing that into the queue itself. I guess if the employer decide, they can withdraw it but otherwise it's continuing. The other thing I did is when when I was moving, my my H-1B was expiring at the time. So I did renew it right before my move. So I got lucky there that the timeline could align. And as soon as I landed here, the very first thing I did is I stamped my visa as well. So that acted as a backup for me that now I have the stamped visa for for 3 years. In case I decide to go back, things will be much smoother, right? So I did that. Yeah, so that was my backup option.

28:55 However, the one thing I would like to call out is I am very much committed to my decision of moving here. Yeah, so any decision in general as well, any decision I made I I I make I I always commit to it. I so So folks, sometimes I move here with the with the mindset that, "Okay, we'll give it a try for couple months or whatever and if it doesn't work out, we'll just move back." If you're in that two-boat situation, you might not like India and you most likely might just move back. So if you're trying it out and moving back to India, I would suggest commit to it and and just you can have your backups, sure, but commit to staying into the India. And so that's how the situation is for me. I have the still the valid visas and whatnot. But I I have no kind of plan to to move back to the states currently. Yeah.

29:44 Got it. Cool. If you're open, [clears throat] I know I think on the financial side you mentioned about you kind of took care because it was always like you have it in the back of the mind. Have you like you know put money in the 401k like you know did you leave it there or did you you know redeem it or what what I mean if you're open to share like what you did with your 401k? Yeah, like so in the states investments mostly are like I was not because I was I had planned to move back I was not into these long term investments. However, 401k has the employer contribution as well. So I was like okay this is free money. Let's let's invest in the at least this much amount so that I I get the match from the employer.

30:29 So that's how I built that portfolio. And currently I'm still managing it. Initially I had thought when I was investing that I might withdraw it with a penalty or whatever, but I decided to

30:41 Not do that. It's it's a it's a huge loss if you if you withdraw it. It's like what you have to pay the income tax at the slab as well as I have to pay a 10% penalty. So I'm retaining it. I also have a son who is who's a US citizen now. So I'm planning to use the 401k money for their education. I think I'm I have right understanding that we can use 401k money for the education purpose. Yeah, so that's how I'm planning to use that. So I'm going to continue to keep that and continue to have that invested and I will withdraw it only for the education purpose. The other investment wise I only mostly had only in equity. So whether ETFs or direct stocks. I'm still managing about 60% of my US portfolio. About 40% I moved back to to India.

31:27 At the time as well I was like okay should I keep it there or should I bring everything here? So I just felt okay let's let's not be greedy in any one side. Just go balanced and keep half half kind of portfolio between the two countries and we'll see how it goes. At least in last one to two years the Indian market is not doing good versus US did good as well as rupees depreciating. So with that if I just do a retrospective I was like okay it would have been better I if I would not have withdrawn the money from the US market. But I think it's fine. It's that those are the kind of risk rewards or balancing that you have to do. Yeah. Thanks for sharing that. Cool. Is there any topic that we haven't covered that

32:11 You want to bring up or any advice for the people who are thinking about moving to India? I think yeah we did touch upon all the finance side. I would suggest folks as well a lot of some of my friends who moved here or who are in the states still. Some of the folks are not that much active in the finance share understanding or the knowledge. I would I would recommend folks to at least go through the basic kind of courses or understanding about all these various kind of tools that we have available whether it's 401k for example, right? A lot of my friends didn't even invest in this initially and then later they realized oh they should have done that, right? So whether it's a 401k or IRA or Roth IRA or whatever these standard tools that we have in states or in India whether it's PF, NPS, PPF, Sukanya Samriddhi. Bunch of these these instruments are available. I would recommend folks be a bit financially as well. Learn

33:11 About this. You don't have to be the expert, but have some idea about these so that you can better balance your portfolios and and use them to these to your your best. Yeah, that's on the finance side and if you are planning to move back couple years before one to two years before at least you can start making some adjustment and you can start creating plans around these things as well so that you don't get surprised. I guess the the one thing that status where we can reset the cost basis without that tax implications. So that that was a pretty pleasant surprising thing that that came my way and I kind of got to know that through these kind of kind of such videos or through some such personal people's opinions and whatnot.

33:58 So that that that was a super good. Some people don't if they are not aware they they miss the window because there's a clear window, right? So yeah, that's where having some financial understanding will will help you like create a better portfolio and have a better investment gain and whatnot. Yeah, that's that's on the finance side. if somebody is moving here definitely they will be looking for job as well, right? So in that I also have a bit of suggestion to folks. Some of my friends who are moving I had kind of recommended the same thing to them as well. If possible try to move internally from a from a company who who has who gives RSUs or ESOPs. They vest in next two to four years or something, but once they are awarded to you will retain them. So if you join in US and you get those RSUs and whatnot there and then move to India. It helps you two ways.

34:48 One you you are familiar with that company and the environment so you will have one less variable to worry about once once you move back here. So you don't have to search for job and you will be mostly focusing on settling in House hunting or or like kids education and whatnot. But job wise you will be settled. As well as the the RSU part will give you like a edge on the good you will have you will be earning better for couple years. That means you are not focused too much now on either job switch or promotion or salary hike. So again you will you can focus on settling and focus on family and these these commitments. Yeah, so if that's an opportunity that's an option for folks do try that out. One of my friend for example left a company and they're like okay I will just find a new job here and later when we talked I was like you could have moved with that company itself and these all benefits you could have used. That's when they regretted it. So it's better to if possible move with the with the within the company with the with RSU options and all.

35:48 So very very valid points. I completely echo and double down on the financial knowledge. I mean especially when you're moving with some good significant assets in two countries understanding the cross border taxation, the tax planning, understanding the RNOR. These are all critical and if you miss that window you'll be paying huge amount in taxes in the country which you don't want. So it's worth investing some time understanding these things and at basic income we have a course actually talking through that. It's very important to just go through it and understand the knowledge. It's such an important one especially when someone is living in abroad for a decade or more than five years they would have some significant assets and they need to understand what's the best way to handle that. So Thanks a lot Harish for taking the time and sharing your journey. Really appreciate you being very open and sharing your thoughts and inputs on how one can navigate this and the best way you know think about moving to India and

36:49 Good luck with everything. Thank you. Thank you Avinash and yes this has been a good good conversation and thanks to the all the episodes that you are sharing. I also had watched those and that helped me prepare better. Yeah, so thank thanks for sharing people's journey and personal experiences. Sure.