Watch: After 10 Years in US, I Took a Big Salary Cut to Build This Life in India | Worth It?

2:48 >> So, for how long were you in US before the thought of moving back to India occurred? >> Yeah, for about 10 years. So, I was there till about 2018 and I studied for about three of those years and then worked for about seven. And then I I had been actually thinking about moving back to India for about a year and a half or so before I actually made the move. So, it wasn't like a snap decision or anything. And the reason was manifold because see I saw myself settling down in US if I continued the path that I was on because, you know, I was at a consulting firm and they had told me that I was on the partnership track and which means, you know, you get equity in the company and then you just become very entrenched in the system, right? Once you do that. I also had a girlfriend, a very stable relationship at the time.

3:40 Somebody who I met at NYU. So, she was born and raised in US. And so, I knew like if I got married or if I took the partnership offer, likely my life was determined for the foreseeable future of, you know, being settled in the US. And so, there were, you know, basically two roads ahead. And one was that I take the, you know, road more taken, which is, you know, you settle down in US, get married, and then, you know, continue to do the things that you were doing. Or you, you know, put consider the potential of being in India, closer to parents, closer to family, or at least trying out how you fit into Indian culture as an adult, which I had never experienced because I went to US when I was just 17.

4:29 And before that, I had also been in boarding school for 4 years. So, essentially, I'd been away from home for more than half my life. So, that really made me feel like, "Okay, if I And yeah, so some of those things caused a lot of regret, and I didn't want to have the same regrets again. So, I I think that was one of the main reasons, but apart from that, I also saw India as like a burgeoning economy. You know, just something that was growing by leap and bounds, you know, especially starting in like 2013, 2014.

5:17 And a lot of the people who I knew in India who had like, for example, my friends from college who had gone back right after college, they also seemed to be very, very positive and optimistic about India's potential. And that was a draw as well, I won't lie. So, it wasn't just like a family-oriented decision, it was also like, "Hey, let's explore, you know, what kind of opportunities I might get in India." that being said, the biggest you know, sort of factor that that was a question mark was actually my domain expertise because in US the field that I was in was it was basically executive compensation and corporate governance consulting. Now, that is something that is very unique, very niche and very specialized, right? So, in US there are maybe about 1,000 to 1,500 people who work in that field overall and in India there are less than 100 people who work in that field. So, you know, there was hardly

6:19 Any opportunity that I could come across which would align with that and I didn't want to switch career paths right away right when I was switching countries because that would that would have really made things very very difficult to navigate, right? So much change all at once. So, I wanted to continue in the same path and that took some time to figure out, okay, if I'm going to move to India, what kind of firms or you know, opportunities would make sense. So, that held me back for a couple of months, but thankfully it all worked out. >> let's talk on the career front like

6:55 You mentioned about so, were you able to identify a role similar to like what you were doing or like you before the move or after the move like how did you transition from a career perspective? >> Yeah, that one is an interesting story actually because I think I made up my mind in early 2018 like around Jan or Feb that I was going to move back to India and I was then just waiting to get the right offer to be able to implement that move. I initially spent about a month actually applying to jobs on portals which were not very always up my alley or you know, related to the work that I had been doing, but I just thought, you know, since I'm not finding any other opportunities, might as well just try and see what happens. And I didn't really hear back from anybody. I must have applied to maybe about 50 jobs or something like that, 40-50 jobs at least, and then didn't hear a single, you know, positive response. And that really threw me off, so I kind of

7:56 Abandoned that strategy altogether because it felt like a waste of time. And I started thinking about networking. The only issue with networking was that I had never lived in India as an adult or worked in India ever. So, all of my network was primarily my childhood friends, some of my college friends who had returned to India, and, you know, my parents and family friends and those kind of people. Now, none of them worked in the field that I was targeting. So, ultimately, I really had to think hard, and I figured out that there I knew certain people in the US who had moved from India recently for their masters, and then they started working in US after their masters. And they had a network in India because they had prior experience working in India. So, essentially, what I did was I leveraged second-degree network. So, I reached out to people who I knew in US who were from India and told them that, you know, I was planning that move.

8:49 Initially, a lot of them, you know, sort of asked me like why I was doing this and sort of discouraged me because this was pre-COVID. People were not really moving back to India that much. but yeah, my mind was made, so I told them why, and then once they got convinced, you know, they activated their network. So, I would say like I reached out to maybe four or five people who I knew like that. Out of that, two people activated their networks, connected me to a few folks, and then within a month of that happening, month or two, I had three offers, right? So, that networking strategy is something I talk about in my current role frequently with people who are also in similar situations, right? Trying to move back. lot of people like give up very quickly, you know, on networking, and I feel you just have to possess because my story is case in point and I know hundreds of other stories now where people have been able to return in in a similar fashion. Yeah. But I mean, I would also say my journey was a little more unique given the kind of role that

9:51 I was in because a lot of times like let's say you have been you know, in tech or engineering roles you will find easily something in India. It's not an issue. Even like I would say broad-based management consulting if you've done, it's fine. It's just that my area of consulting was highly highly unique and specialized. That's what made it so challenging at the time. >> Got it. And you were able to find a job in a similar role or a similar niche. >> Yeah, very similar role. So actually I ended up joining the largest HR consulting firm in the world which is Mercer. And at the time they were sort of establishing the executive remuneration and governance practice for India. There was no you know, sort of leader for that particular vertical. So that's what they hired me for and asked me to build that for them. So that's a that's the kind of role that really you know, fit what I was looking for. so yeah, it worked out pretty well.

10:55 >> So let's go back to your decision process, right? I mean, I understand the reasons why you wanted to move back to India. Were you thinking along the lines that you want to give it a try for some years because you were in a relationship, you have a good career, everything is going great. Like, okay, you know, you don't want to repent. Like if you take the other path, you might not be able to live or move back, right? So you wanted to take that decision at that time. Was it like a permanent like in the back of the mind or you wanted to like, okay, let's explore and you haven't lived in India as an adult. You wanted to see the opportunities, you wanted to see how it goes and then kind of decide like you know, how did you approach the decision process because it's a big decision. And yeah, yeah, yeah. >> Yeah, that's a very good question. I actually at the time, I felt like I could not decide everything about my long-term, you know, professional and personal life. All I knew was that I did not want to not have the opportunity to live in

11:56 India or experience India as an adult. So, essentially, I I would say indirectly, what that means is I had not decided that I'm moving to India for good, which is actually true today because now I have dual base and you know, I'm basically living in both in India and US you know, part of my year. And but at that time in 2018, I don't think anybody or even I myself knew exactly what the long-term future held. All I was going doing was going with the flow of saying that, "Okay, I know that I want to be in India right now. I don't know for how long and whether I will settle down there for good or I'll come back." But but yeah, that's how the decision was at that time. And then slowly, you know, obviously with certain personal, professional you know, things evolving, I finally decided what I wanted to do. And we, like me and my wife, made this sort of unique decision to build a dual base. So,

12:57 Me and my wife made this sort of unique decision to COVID ended, we have spent almost I >> Got it. So, let's I think talk about the the first move and then

13:15 We can come back to the current life. So, in 2018, is there anything that you want to talk from a planning perspective, any types about the career side, which is a critical one? anything on the finance side, logistics side, anything that you can share that you planned during that >> Yeah. See, I think a lot of people the the common questions that I hear from people who are relocating back to India after spending, you know, time in US or Europe. I think number one is getting the job, right? That's the most important thing. And I've already talked about the importance of networking when it comes to finding the right role. There are many more opportunities available for returnees today than there were back in the day like 7-8 years ago. I think companies are a little more used to having, you know, people return from abroad than they were earlier. So, they have, you know, more acclimatization sort of programs or there might be other people

14:16 Who you can learn from how they acclimatize. For me, I think one thing was getting the job. The second was acclimatization back into a different work culture. And good thing was I talked to a lot of people before I made my move. And many people, like I mentioned to you, they did discourage me from making the move not just for financial reasons but also like they they didn't think like I would acclimatize well to the work culture because it's very different compared to New York's work culture. But again, you know, like I told you my mind was made up. So, it was less of a, you know, decision-making exercise and more of a you know, just a learning exercise to understand hey, how does India's work culture, you know, actually work and what are the things that I should look out for, how can I navigate, you know, tricky situations. So, one of the things that I knew that India was a very price sensitive and relationship driven market compared to the US market, right? And that came out to be absolutely true. But thankfully, you know, I was going into it with my wide eyes wide open because I

15:17 Had had these discussions with a lot of people especially within the space that I was in. So, I think talking to a lot of people who are already there working in your target space, understanding how you know, things work, what are the key priorities for that market, that always helps. Really, really helps. If you assume that, okay, I have already done this in US and US is a much more mature market, higher value driven market, so I can just go into India and apply the same principles and it will all work out, I think you will probably be surprised how, you know, untrue that assumption is, right? even if you think about like Amazon, for example, one of the companies which has spent billions and billions of dollars into capturing the India market, they still have so many things that have not worked out for them, even though they are highly profitable in in US. so, that is just one thing that I think a lot of people from a work angle should take into consideration that you might have had a lot of good experience, but

16:17 You still need to understand India's, you know, market which is very unique in and of itself, and and how do you navigate that market? The second thing I would say is in terms of the finances part. See, the good thing is you usually have a good savings if you have worked in in US or Europe. So, financial financially the only concern is how do I decide what is the right CTC or compensation for me if I'm moving to India? Because I'm not going to get the same offer in US. And I was paid fairly, fairly lucratively when I was in US. And I knew based on certain discussions what the market rate was for India, which was almost a 75% cut if I look at the, you know, nominal numbers. even if it was adjusted for purchasing power parity, even then it was a bit of a, you know, discount compared to what I was expecting.

17:17 But again, I was okay with it because overall from a lifestyle perspective, it supported my lifestyle. So, I had no issues regarding that. I was still single and didn't have any dependents. so, it worked out well for me. But yeah, I mean, you you do want to think about what is the right number for you. Especially if you have dependents, then you might need to evaluate opportunities more from a financial perspective than I did at the time. And you might need to negotiate offers before you accept the one that's right for you. yeah, so I mean, that's the financial side of things. And logistics-wise, personally speaking, I you know, I'm a person who tries to be a minimalist when it comes to you know, tethering yourself or linking yourself to a lot of materialistic things or you know, big possessions or anything like that.

18:09 So, when you're sort of like a minimalist like that, it's very easy to be mobile, right? If you tether yourself to things and you have a lot of entrenched you know, assets in different places, becomes harder to move around. So, yeah, for me, I mean, I had a 401k and you know, all of those things were there, but apart from that, I didn't really have major possessions that you know, I needed to sell like a house or anything like that. So, it was fairly easy of a move for me. the main thing was like what to do with my financial assets and certain other investments and all that. Yeah.

18:44 >> So, based on what you know right now in 2026, is there a range that you can provide based on your experience, based on what you have seen in the market? like someone who is moving from US or UK, like what's the range in a nominal value, not from a purchase power parity, like that they can expect based on their experience? >> Well, it varies significantly by experience and role, obviously. But I think that the numbers are much higher than what it would be probably eight years ago. So, like for example, consulting at the time would pay for somebody who had 10 years Well, I had 7 years experience, but they were paying me more like I had 10 plus years experience. So, that would pay somewhere in the range of let's say 35 to 45 50 at most. Today, I think the same number would be closer to 75 to 80 likely.

19:33 If you are in AI ML roles, which are some of the hottest roles right now, you're probably looking at one CR plus kind of a number with even I would say around 10 years experience, right? so, yeah, I think it varies a lot. Avinash, I won't be able to give just, you know, one number or a range. But what I would say is typically you can expect a reduction of anywhere between 25 30%, which is the best-case scenario, to in even about 75%, which is primarily, I would say, the worst-case scenario. >> Yeah, I heard of this number between like, you know, 1/3 to 2/3 is the range depending on the niche and you know, whatever the job. >> Yeah. Yeah, I mean, approximately that. I was seeing I've seen slightly wider ranges, but yeah, I think I would align with that.

20:23 >> Let's talk about the life in India. So, you know, you moved with a certain expectations, you made the decision, you're trying to learn how to adapt to the Indian work culture, lifestyle, and all that stuff. So, how did the life evolve in the last eight years? I know you kind of give a glimpse into it that you're spending half. I think that's an interesting aspect of the story also. but yeah, like walk us through like what happened and how this all evolved. >> Yeah. So, I mean, I'll talk more about the first two years because then COVID happened, right? And COVID obviously was a huge you know, game-changing kind of an experience for everybody. But I think the first two years were the ones where I really had to sort of understand how India works both on a personal and professional level. So, the acclimatization took some time, but again for me it was very much my decision. It wasn't somebody thrusting that decision on me.

21:19 So, I really enjoyed that whole experience quite a bit because, you know, anytime you go through a challenge that you have taken up on your own, it's kind of like a invigorating, exhilarating kind of an experience as opposed to, you know, somebody thrusting it on you, then it becomes stressful. So, I mean, the first thing I would say is I remember there were certain client meetings that we had where literally from month one I was put into board rooms of some of the largest companies in India, publicly listed companies, and I was leading the client meetings from the consulting perspective. And there there were certain times when the kind of discussions that were happening were very very different compared to what I was used to in the US.

22:06 Focusing much less on the subject matter, much more on just subjective opinions and hear-says, and you know, just everything but the actual topic itself. And then yeah, I think after maybe 3 months or so, I felt quite at home. I had gotten decent amount of experience and exposure to Indian clients, different type of companies, both, you know, what we call typically the Lala companies or, you know, the founder promoter driven companies, which are laggards typically. And then obviously professionally run MNCs and those kind of things as well. So, I started to get early off the land and you know, that worked out well. Personally, I think that was the most fulfilling decision that I made.

22:51 I feel like I would have had a big regret if I did not return to India at that time because, just you know, as a lot of people would tell you like you know, your parents are getting older, your you know, you have been away from your siblings and family friends and relatives for so long. You're missing like all the celebrations and functions and everything that's happening. So you just get disconnected completely from your family unless you already have like a big family in US which I didn't. I had few relatives which were who were really dispersed all across US. So I didn't really get to see them that much even. Like my own sister was also in US. She's still in US but she was on the west coast and I was on the east coast. So you know, it was very hard to stay frequently connected. But moving back to India brought that part of my life back into action again and I thought that was a huge vacuum before.

23:49 Yeah, so I just felt much more connected to my culture, to my people and yeah, I had a lot of fun, you know. And that was one of the main reasons I wanted to move back. Not just like you know, attending weddings and functions and stuff but also being there for people when they need you or you need them, you know, that was a huge thing for me and I think a lot of Indians feel very strongly about being there for your loved ones, right? And being in US does not allow you to do that no matter how much money you can send back home or anything like that. So yeah, I mean, I think like I said, it was one of the most fulfilling things for me for sure. Sounds like I think you learned or

24:30 Adapted very quickly how to deal with the Indian clients and you know, the fulfilling that thing. So what happened after two years? Like so the life continued like it did before the COVID and what changed after the COVID, yeah? >> So after two years basically I made two big decisions because I was almost about to turn 30 and I was like, okay, before I turn 30 I need to decide you know, a little with little more certainty where my career and my personal life is moving forward. So, I decided to marry my girlfriend who was born and raised in US, the one I met at NYU. We had been in a relationship for like almost I think 8 years or so. So, it's pretty long in the courtship before we decided. And the second decision was that I would start my own startup, which was Pivot.

25:16 So, those are the two big decisions I think I made around end of 2019, early 2020. It was right before COVID happened, just maybe a month or two before COVID happened. And it was funny. So, I actually traveled to US and you know, at that time we I got engaged as well and my wife was going to move back to India with me after a few months because she was still working in US and she had to wrap up a few things and then she would The plan was she would move back to India with me and then we would get married and I would start my business and all those things. And then that's when COVID happened. So, it was like for everybody else, you know, as they say life is what happens when you're busy planning other things. So, that really happened with me and my wife and I could not see each other for almost like 8 months after [music] you know, getting engaged and it was pretty hard. We didn't know like when she was going to be allowed [music] to move from US to India.

26:13 >> So, you came back to India. Sorry to interrupt. So, after the engagement you came back to India. >> I came back to India. >> Got it. So, you were stuck here in India. >> Because our plan was to get married in India and that she we would start by setting up our base in India because see we we had both lived in US, but she had never lived in India. [music] So, what I wanted was that when we start our, you know, married life, that we started from India. That was >> [music] >> my goal. And she was on board with that plan because we also wanted to get married in India. But yeah, so obviously COVID threw a huge wrench. And at the same time, you know how you know, proof everybody was very concerned about layoffs and you know, economic downturn and all that stuff that was happening around >> early 2020 and 2021. so, even from a professional angle, a lot of people were asking me, "Hey, you have a cushy consulting career, >> and you just made this move to India.

27:04 You sure you want to make such a big move by starting something of your own at this particular juncture?" [music] And yeah, so I think with regard to the professional decision, I was quite sure [music] that I was going to continue on that path of starting something of my own. I felt like COVID, if anything, would actually [music] accelerate the the macro trends which led me to start Pivot in the first place. But, it was a hypothesis. There was not a lot of validation or proof. [music] So, it was a risky bet, for sure. But, I was again quite determined [music] to, you know, start my own thing. And with regard to my wife, she ultimately was able to move to India around, I think, August or September of 2020. And so, yeah, we were apart for around 8-9 months, which was unplanned. Like, our plan was maybe be apart for 2 months, and then she would move. So, it extended because of COVID. But, yeah, that's that's how it turned out. And then, obviously, thankfully, we experienced [music] the lockdown together. right

28:04 After lockdown, we got married, and we had a beautiful wedding. And yeah, that's how things transpired.

28:15 >> What motivated you to start Pivot? like, you know, especially again, you know, you are you made the decision before the COVID. was there anything that you saw, or like it's just that different gap, or like the culture, like what made you to, you know, go in that direction? >> Yeah, actually, so, you know, it was a couple of different things that made me want to start Pivot. So, first was actually when I was in US, I had seen my wife go through a major career shift. She used to work at TED Talks, and she used to run basically one of their fellowship programs. So, TED has fellows they sponsor their ideas and you know, give them money and resources to build on those ideas. So, she used to run that program for those fellows. And it was more like an operations and you know, application assessment kind of a program that she used to run. She wanted to transition to media and entertainment which she wanted to become a writer and a producer.

29:13 That was just like her dream role and she had always wanted to do that. So, she held off on that for a long time and then there came a time when she was like, I really want to do it. So, but but there was no like support system. There was no you know, I would say even a course that she could take really because you don't study really for TV and for entertainment, right? Like if you look at most of the actors, writers, you know, other creative talent out there, they don't have education in that specific field. Most of them just do it serendipitously, right? And they just have to be very very courageous and bold to be able to pull it off. So, anyways, long story short, I saw how she made a huge decision about a career again left her cushy career at TEDTalks and just thrust herself into, you know, trying to build her career in media and entertainment and took her almost year and a half or 2 years where she was doing a lot of like

30:14 In between jobs kind of a thing where it would be like freelancing for, you know, different types of companies. She freelanced for LinkedIn and Samsung, but she also freelanced for like a film festival and you know, for production company and it was very haphazard, extremely stressful because of the uncertainty. She did not know whether she was going to you know, land a full-time role with a stable pay and opportunity. And even if like she was able to pull it off, the journey that she had to go through I thought was one of the most disjointed, stressful, exhausting, and lonely kind of a journey.

31:01 >> After getting married, like how things evolved and like where is this decision about spending 6 months in India and 6 months in US start? Yeah, so I think at the time my wife and I got married, one of the you know, sort of deals that we had was that we were going to build a dual base because we are both very family-oriented people and so the only way our relationship would work was that hey, we don't completely disconnect from either family, all right? Which meant like we couldn't really settle down in either country because of the distance. And so we thought that the best way to do it was build certain type of careers which allow us to live this sort of independent lifestyle, more you know, mobile lifestyle. And simultaneously build a dual base in both countries.

31:53 That's where it started and I actually from a professional angle also, I felt the startup that I was working on had a lot of potential in both countries. I didn't feel like it was just restricted to one country. Like there if you think about a lot of startups in India, they'll either primarily cater to India or primarily cater to the US, right? Very few focus on both from day one. And I felt like ours was a startup which could actually cater to both countries from the first year itself and we did. The only thing I would say, yeah, I mean it was hard in COVID to kind of you know, get a lot of traction in US and I didn't really even end up trying to capture the US market the first few months, but slowly you know, word started to just spread across both India and US because I had worked in US, I had a community in US. When people saw me working on this idea, they just organically started sharing it within their network if they thought somebody could be benefited by our startup. So,

32:55 So yeah, I think the idea for two bases was more of a personal angle, but it fit really well into our professional goals as well. The only thing which has been the most challenging is like, you know, when let's say I am in US or my wife is in India, we have slightly crazy, you know, time zone experience because we both have to kind of stay up late to work with our teams, right? Because our teams are based in the other country typically. So, my wife has to work with US teams, I have to work with primarily India teams, so that requires us to manage and juggle our time, you know, time zones and all. Slightly tricky manner. But apart from that, I think apart from the time zone issue, I think it's not really been that challenging for us building a dual base.

33:45 Housing has obviously been, you know, a little bit of an issue, but today like we don't own a house yet. We have deliberately decided not to invest in a house right now at least. But we have been able to find some really good Airbnbs or, you know, sometimes even, you know, like for example, during COVID we did have a, you know, one-year lease in Bombay and it's not that hard to find apartments if you want to find short-term rentals and those kind of things anymore. So, from a logistics standpoint also, it was fine. Yeah, overall it's worked out fine. I don't know what the future holds. I don't know how long we will do this. Once you start a family and, you know, raising kids and all that. But so far so good.

34:31 >> Got it. So, I mean that was my question. So sounds like I think we'll wait and see how the future evolves and in your wife so it sounds like the business or the profession is more based on the US side. So that's why she has to spend like maybe US time when she's in India. Got it. >> Yeah, exactly. >> Are there any cons of doing it? I know the pros are like being close to the family and you know able to spend time on the personal side professionally I think it also helping like it's hard like doing it like every year 6 months there 6 months here like What are the some of the things that you have to compromise or give up doing this because it's not that easy to maintain that. Yeah.

35:18 Yeah, no it's not. It has its fair share of challenges and I might have made it sound easier than it is perhaps because I feel like when people first think about this like when they when we tell them hey you know this is what we are doing a lot of people have never heard of this kind of a lifestyle. So they're very confused how somebody can actually pull something like this off. So I am usually a little more biased towards explaining to them how it is workable solution. It's not that hard but it has its fair share of challenges and I would say the challenges number one just you know always missing people on the other side who are not with you. Also like I said the work you know can become hard for at least one of the person in the relationship depending on where your team is. So if you're moving around too much but you still See firstly we are fortunate that we are working in a role which does not tether us to one place because we don't have to go in person to an office.

36:15 Right? So that's the fortunate part but the not so fortunate part is we still have to talk to people in different time zones. So that means compromising on your sleep, compromising on your health. Right? That can happen at times Like I when I'm in US, I typically end up staying up till, you know, 3:00 a.m., 4:00 a.m. many, many times. All right? Similar time zone issues for my wife as well where she ends up staying up till like 1:00 a.m. or 2:00 a.m. So, that is I would say a significant disadvantage. also not having a place where you can just go and call home. All right? And just have all your things. But I think that was more of a deliberate decision for a temporary situation for us. I don't think it will be a forever situation. Like I'm sure we will have a home at some point. And many people when they decide to move, they do purchase a home in one place or the other. So, I think that's more of an individual specific consideration. But yeah, I mean sometimes when you are just like living out of suitcases or if you have Airbnb

37:17 Kind of or short-term rentals, you have to kind of, you know, set up the place every single time you move. So, I think those are the key challenges. Sometimes if you're exploring a new city or a new town, then you have to, you know, build your community all over again. But we haven't had to do that because, you know, we have primarily oscillated between New York and Bombay. And so, in both places we have a good group of friends and relatives and all those things. So, so yeah.

37:48 >> So, how does it work from a taxation? I mean, if you're open like because you're spending time, I mean, typically people who are in the retirement, they try to spend time between US and India. So, in your case, you're still building the business and startup and you know, anything from those perspective like finances, taxes that you can share. >> See, on the So, firstly, taxes can be both for your company if you're an entrepreneur as well as, you know, your personal taxes. So, I think for most people, it's about the personal taxation. I think for most people you have at least between US and India there's a DTAA, right? Double Tax Avoidance Treaty. And for I mean that's a huge boon. Basically, you if you have paid taxes on your income in one country, you don't have to pay it on the other. But yeah, you have to make sure that your taxes are done in a very professional and comprehensive manner. So, you might need to either hire you know an accountant who understands global taxation, right? Or you could

38:50 Use I think there are certain very sophisticated tools as well today like both in India and US that you can use to do your own taxes and they account for people who have spent like part of the year in different countries, right? So, I I think generally speaking, you might end up paying slightly higher tax if you have a dual base kind of a lifestyle. But yeah, I mean I haven't really seen any major penalization happening because of that. Because I mean you like I said, you don't have to pay taxes in both countries. You just have to file your returns in both countries and you have to show that you have paid taxes at least in one country on each income dollar or rupee that you have earned.

39:35 That's on the personal side. I don't know if you want to know more on the corporate side of things. I don't know if people would be interested in knowing >> Yeah, I think we can keep it to the personal for now. I think just to make >> Cool. is there anything that we haven't covered that you want to bring up or any advice for people who are thinking about moving to India or spending time between both countries? >> Yeah. Yeah, I feel like you know there are a lot of people I come across who are thinking about moving to India and genuinely what I see is that they are very clear about their move similar to how I was that they want to do it. what they they are concerned about is their lifestyle, their job, and just, you know, being able to implement the transition. I think that's what they're concerned about. So, most of the times people are held back because of those reasons as opposed to not wanting to move to India. It's more about those reasons. So, if you're able to, you know, kind of find the right job

40:36 Opportunity first, I think that will give you a huge peace of mind. So, whatever you can do to get that, whether it is, you know, applying on job boards or networking heavily with people in India or anyone who can, you know, put your name forward in front of recruiters, hiring managers, I think that can be really, really powerful. secondly, I think in terms of, you know, lifestyle, I think that is also something a lot of people do get concerned. Oh, there's so much traffic, pollution, you know, a certain other challenges that they don't feel very, very aligned with. But I I would say, you know, challenges are everywhere, at least from my perspective. I don't think, you know, US either has like a very utopian kind of a lifestyle anymore, either. There, you know, you have to do all the household chores yourself and those kind of things. So, it's it's a personal preference. I think, you know, what lifestyle you prefer. But if you you have lived in India and you're thinking about moving back to India, likely you

41:37 Understand India's lifestyle and challenges. It's just that there might be certain people who have been away from India for very long, so they just don't know how things are going to be. And for those people, I would say India has become way more convenient than before. yes, pollution is there. Yes, traffic is there, but I wouldn't say it's like significantly worse than it was like 5, 10 years ago, all right? If anything, I mean, like, you know, I hail from a town called Meerut, as I said, and Meerut actually recently got a rapid rail transportation railway system. That gets you to Delhi within less than 15 minutes. Earlier it used to take us like almost 3 hours or 4 hours. So, in a lot of ways infrastructure is really improving and commute is a commutes are getting better.

42:25 So, I think there's a lot of positive development happening as well. So, people are sometimes overly concerned based on what they read in media or hear from certain critics about lifestyle issues. I personally have found India to be very easy to adjust to in terms of lifestyle. And if you're worried about like cosmopolitan kind of culture, I think obviously then go to some of the metro hubs, right? Like you have Bombay and Bangalore, to some extent even Delhi and certain other cities as well like Hyderabad, Chennai, etc. You can find a lot of you know, diverse you know, people from diverse backgrounds and culture. So, yeah, I I don't see a lifestyle issue either. And then the part around transition implementation, I think I have already covered you know, how that can happen.